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carlgo

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 #1 
What I have found with this method is that I do better when that angle between the forearm and club shaft is shallow, which means as vertical a posture as possible, especially on the long irons. The ball is simply closer to me.

The same is also true of the forward shaft lean. A little lean does it for me, allows a better turn, less chance of forward sway and I end up on the outside of my front foot as instructed. If I try to get distance by reducing the loft, it just goes way too low.

I am 6.2. Is this a common finding with your students? In any case, maybe this would help some people who have puzzling results when they assume the "pro" bend and try to get those impossible ranges with lofty clubs. 
Ross

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 #2 
That is all good!

Finding the right "shaft alignment" at setup, takes a little practice and everyone is a little different (strength, posture, grip etc.). 

I think what you discovered, (that most golfers don't know), is how the golf shaft reacts "dynamically" through impact.  The inertia of the club head, pulls down when it's traveling at 80-100+ mph during the swing (through impact).  This will force the back of the front thumb and wrist to "raise up".  This usually removes any preset inward, angles* the wrists made at setup.  This also can make the "toe" of the club dig deeper than the "heel" if you look at your divots.  This can also be the wrong shaft for your swing.  There are many trade offs.

One of the best ways to find how that shaft should be is to ... hold the club with the front hand only  ... squeeze a bit with your hand, and then move the club around using your arm, finding the strongest position (no floppy wrist).  Try to control the club and it will settle into the strongest position.  This is the best position for you when you setup and swing.  This takes practice. 

FYI... that shaft MUST be inline with the front arm at impact ... period!  The butt of the club will NOT be pointing at your belly or forward of your front arm ... must be inline at impact!


* The angles that would have the back of the thumb/wrist bent inward (not flat or bowed up).

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carlgo

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 #3 
Ross, thanks. Exactly. The flatter the angle, the less I instinctively feel the need to moderate things to counter any forces. I know I was compensating for this before, with the expected mixed results. Looking at a reflection, angles are still there, not out straight like Moe or acute like you see on many videos. 

I think I might amend your suggestion to find the strongest angle to doing that and then flattening it out further a couple of degrees, to really keep that angle intact on full swings. Maybe that is another level of complication... 

One thing that may be helping me is that my clubs are old eBay Ping ISI white dots, the size for taller people. The shafts I think are more vertical. I do not feel as comfortable with the long hybrids whose shafts are more horizontal. Perhaps they should be bent up a bit. 

Oh, and thanks for mentioning that I may have a 100+ mph iron swing. Surely that is true...
Ross

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 #4 
If you're not sure about the white dot lie angle, you can put tape on the bottom of the leading edge and hit on a hitting board and look at the mark.  You want it right in the middle.  If the mark is more toe or heel, they need to be adjusted for your swing.  If the lie angle is way off, you may have a problem (if I remember right), in that Ping can only be adjusted a certain amount.
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DJC2650

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 #5 
Just a comment and I hope this makes sense.  I had been hitting many of my shots pointed right or hooking right with a few slices thrown in.  I was concentrating on keeping the original angle of club to my wrists intact through out the back swing and not hinging or turning my fore arms.

I was finding that I was not rotating well on the back swing and my arms were getting caught too low because I was not letting my arms rise out naturally on the back swing.

Making much, much better contact now and the swing feels much better as I am letting my arms rise naturally in the backswing while I keep turning around my spine.

Before I was letting my arms hang low a bit too much.  

Wondered if anyone else experienced this.
Ross

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 #6 
Just a thought on DJC2650's comment...  

Some golfers grab the club when it is on the ground, and then close the arms against their sides.  This pinches the pecs and the shoulders can't turn freely.

A good way to get the arms in the correct position at setup, is once you take your grip, start  with them out in front of you, elbows close, then "let that hang".  Now, the arms/club can be controlled by the SHOULDERS.  The shoulders do the work on the backswing.  The shoulders turn around the spine and this is what will bring the arms/club up for the club you are using.  The arms do not lift themselves.


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DJC2650

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 #7 
Thanks Ross.  Yes, that describes it exactly.  I need to readjust my pre-shot routine to make sure I am letting the arms (or the template as I call it now) hang correctly and freely.

As a by the way, I am finding that setting up the template with the elbows pointing the hips correctly is a great way to visualize the shot from behind the ball in the pre-shot set up and helps me get my target and aim set up too.

Probably obvious to the 'Ross' golf community out there but helpful to me as I migrate from old swing habits.
Ross

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 #8 
Yes, taking a moment (like Jason Day), to see your shot and recall when you've taking the shot before and were successful is VERY powerful.  It really works great around the green to imagine the entire trip the ball will take to end "in" or "by" the hole.  Then just hit your spot at the speed you imagined (don't forget to allow for break too).
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